What is good enough?

[Izak]

Hello all

As you might have gathered I did not have a very happy Patrol weekend.

My submission is that the Patrol in standard form is a great vehicle for the average 4x4 use, but as soon as things get a little more technical they do not cope as well as some other standard 4x4 vehicles. (Land Cruisers, some of the Jeeps and the G-Wagon).

This weekend at the Klipkoppie thing I could not complete two of the obstacles because of the break over angle on the Patrol and the fact that I did not have front lockers. At the 60th birthday celebrations at Three Provinces I did everything with ease except that hill climb that Cedric and a couple of others completed. At Heidelberg 4x4 route I got soundly stuck in the mud.

So now my rhetorical question is what is good enough? The fact that I can do, say 70% of all obstacles with the minimum effort, or to spend at least R 50 000 extra ( a set of BFG MUDS will set me back about R 15000, a good suspension kit (EFS) in the region of R12000, Snorkel at R 4500 and lockers or limited slip diff at R 12000??? and then a rear replacement steel bumper to stop the tow bar from ploughing furrows in the rock, mud, sand) on the Patrol to be able to do 99% of all obstacles.

I ask myself after this weekend how much testosterone is involved in this unease in my heart. Is it hurt pride that my beloved Patrol could not finish and that my ego got hurt in the process or is it the untapped potential of the Patrol that is latent but evident?


As Obelix said when he was in love, Sigh, BIGGER SIGH, BIGGEST SIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Kagiso II]

eisjjj - Sakkie hirri is vir om 'n hoogvalm braaivuur, groot Windhoek inni hand [jy kan Oros kry] en dan oor-en-weer klankbord.
Voor jy vir iemand anders oppi forum murrag raak - ek sommer nou al vir jou sê: IEMAND hier gaan ook iewers vir jou vra weet JY genoegsaam om standaard Trollie tot sy reg te laat kom? -- [ek weet wat jy kan doen .. ] hanteer maar net die vragie, as hy kom, omsigtig .. nie ammal weet hoe knap jy kan ry, nie.

[Alex Roux]

In standard (factory spec) form:
Yes Jeep Wrangler / Rubi and GWagon have better breakover angle. But I don't think the factory spec LC does?

But that is the only issue. Certainly not front lockers. I have seen impossible obstacles being driven by trols without front lockers activated. GWagons do however need them less rarely because of poorer wheel travel.
Rubi owners would tell you that they never need front lockers. Some say you only need them to get OUT of trouble. When you plan using them and get INto trouble, well then you really have trouble!

Factory spec LC versus factory spec Trol: In terms of capability I would say it is very even, except maybe the Trol drivetrain will take more punishment before it breaks and maybe has a bit more wheel travel too.

But if you are serious about making the trol a crawler that can keep up with Rubis, then I would start withthe suspension lift. The rest has less of an impact, as long as your rear locker still works.

[Tinus lotz]

mater dit is n diep vraag ?????
volgens my het jy die beste uit alle kante met wat jy nou het!
ja die rubicon doen beter op die trails as n standaard patrol maar dis al.......hy het nie pakplek nie sleep nie so lekke nie werk nie so goed op die sand nie het jy al met een van daai 12 ure lank moz toe gery????nie lekke nie
die 80 en 105 cruiser is omtrent dieselde kar as wat jy het net dubbel die geld
g wagon ja ek sal nie my patrol vir een van daai ruil nie omdat hulle stadig en ongemaklik is wel goed in die veld maar geen flex nie en min pakplek vir mense en goeders
my raad is pimp jou trollie net so bietjie........285 75 16 muddies km2 gaan jou so 13k kos ek het myne opgesit net voor Piet se troue lift kit met shocks nog so 12k by la sport
los dan maar die voor diff lock want jou patrollie het genoeg flex
dis 25k maar nie 250k meer as wat jy nou betaal het nie
die GU is n harde 4 x 4 so hard as wat hulle kom maar hoe se hulle ????elke sport het sy beserings miskien net die rowwe goed vir die manne met die pypkarre los ??????
ons almal speel graag met ons 4x4 maar as dit jou elke dag ry kar is is dit moeilik

[Herrie]

Die Patrol se wheelbase (2970mm) is langer as die Cruiser en die enigste 4x4 wat 'n langer wheelbase het is die Navara met 3200mm.

Dit is hoekom jy nou en dan op jou pens gaan lê. Die bewys was ook Saterdag toe Alex en Cedric nie uit die moddergat kon kom nie om dat hulle net 'n 50mm lift het. Grant het 'n 100mm lift op sy Patrol en hy het daar deur gekom al het sy Patrol se maag ook die grond geraak.

Die Patrol se suspensie is die beste en het nie regtig ekstra difflocks nodig nie. 'n 50mm lift en 285/75x16 bande wat M/T is maak 'n groot verskil.

[ricster]

I agree with what's been said above.... A 50mm suspension lift will ( Old Man Emu) will cost you +/- R12 500 ( coils and shocks ). This will make a huge difference to your 4x4 experience. ( this gets rid of Obelix's first sigh )..... yes, tyres do make a huge difference. I presume you are still on the 265's, which is +/- a 31" outside diameter. The next step would be 285's ( 33" outer diameter ) ( this gets rid of Obelix's second sigh ).

With the suspension giving you 2" lift, the new 33" will give you another 1"..... that's a total of 3". Yes the tyres are expensive..... but shop around and fight for a good price. I paid R 7900 for my 4 Kumho M/T, ok granted, it was about a year and a bit. I use my Iron Maiden everyday for work, but only work 7km from home. For someone using it everyday, hmmmm maybe an all terrain tyre, if you don't want to hear the relatively loud road noise these tyres make.
BUT........

With just these 2 things...... you will be virtually unstoppable ...... I couldn't get out of the mud hole on Saturday..... and neither could the jeep that came out of the mud hole missing bits of bodywork !!!! ..... I came out of it with just a loose front mud flap.... which has been flopping around for many months..... ( note to self..... fit bigger screw to hold flap better)

Snorkels and front lockers..... those are extra luxury items that are a nice to have..... not a necessity. A front bash plate and transfer case bash plate, from Peter Connan, is worth the money too.... just gives you the confidence that when you do hear/feel a bump under your ass you know that all should still be good and that the bash plate took the punishment.

The rear bumper....... hmmmm.... well I suppose every vehicle must have a weak spot.....ha ha ha..... we are busy looking into this and will soon have a template for an AFFORDABLE reap bumper.....

So.... all in all lets say R 25K... and you have no more Obelix sighs !!!

Have you got aftermarket bullbar and winches and dual battery...etc in front??..... Cause maybe I have a cunning plan for you if you don't have the extra weight in front......hmmmmm

[Dr Chris]

Hell Izak,
I feel for you, and suddenly I feel relieved that I do not have to worry about such costing to achieve these types of goals - maybe some solace in the fact that I am old and retired as a pensioner, and wallowing in the image of being a patrol owner, rather than having to demonstrate my ineptitude?
But it appears that you will recieve massive support and comfort in knowing that you have good mates around you and probable ways of funding cost effective options?
Great topic for debate anyway!
Regards, Chris.

[martyn]

Hi Cedric, are you a cunning linguist to leave us in suspense?

[ricster]

ha ha... I never leave anyone in suspenders.....

I just have my old set of front and rear OME coils that were apparently not meant to have all the extra weight on them that I have on the front end of the Maiden. That's why I changed my coils to heavy duty ones.

[Izak]

Hello weer

Ek gaan nie die keer in Engels ploeter nie, kan myself baie beter in my moeder taal uitdruk.

My innige dank vir die insette. Eerste prys is dus 'n 50mm EFS lift en daarna bande. Dink al rukkie aan die EFS en miskien bietjie later in die jaar as alles goed gaan sal daar "tyd" wees om dit te doen, die bande sal maar moet wag want my BFG All Terrains het nou maar so 32000 km op.

Die een ding wat belangrik is waaroor ons almal saamstem is dat die Patrol 'n "A bloody Mazing" voertuig is, en dat die suspensie en die bande die verskil gaan maak. Die karre wat by Klipkoppie uit die moddergat gekom het was meeste shortwheelbase, met modder bande en met baie meer momentum as was wat bereid is om my kar aan te onderwerp.

Cedric, I have a Sahara ARB bullbar on the Patrol, that is the only extra weight in front. We have to talk about them coils.

As julle al die insette gelees het sou julle gesien het Oom Mac waarsku my teen fyngevoelig wees oor insuniasies oor my vermoee! Het julle ook gesien daar is geen sarkasme, of enige sulke goed nie, net konstruktiewe insette.

Lekke dag vir julle

IJM